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Monday, February 04, 2013


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The Catholic schools often "recruit" our city kids that show potential. They go for a year or two, but can't afford the tuition. The kid gets sent back to his home school. The problem is that they will not send report cards or transcripts until the tuition is paid. Tough on a talented player who is a junior. The NCAA Clearinghouse has rigid standards..he could get left out.

Hey Yale Cup, that is unfortunate and a common consequence, but find your own name. Don't impersonate.

In fairness to the "new" Yale Cup, they may not have known they were impersonating anyone. The last time you graced us with a comment was January 6th, and before that, it was January 1st on a comment you ended with:

"centercourt needs more content to keep this blog alive. SC just wont cut it alone on here."

Between the combination of lapse in time and such outlandish commentary, I'm guessing many forgot about "yale cup". I can say with confidence that your recent comments are not what has kept this blog "alive".

Fair enough and well said. I do have to say, your coverage has been great the last month,to the point it has been hard to keep up on the reading. I am also very glad your hiatus was short lived. I have been very busy myself and have been to only a couple games. i hope to get back in the grind soon.

That's very nice of you to say. Hopefully with the you getting back to the grind soon, your comments will follow. The next month & a half is the greatest time of the year, and there are no exceptions.

If they couldn't pay their tuition while they were there, I don't think they'll be able to pay it off now, especially with the bad economy. What happens to these kids? They must have had great potential, or they wouldn't have landed at the Catholic schools.

Aren't there more serious problems at city schools than this? How about the many players in the city schools that never go anywhere because they can't be accepted to a college.

it should be the same thing. if they dont have grades for college then the privates shouldnt take them either. it not all the private school ballers are all doing good at school. no way.

I don't know about private schools but the statistics I see and read about city schools is like a team losing 65% of their games.

So who has Timon beat to continue to be ranked? St. MAry's? Nichols? or is it beacause of the teams they played close? Jamestown? They are barely over .500 and don't have any quality wins over large schools again. Hopefully thet prove themselves vs BK tonight. Not by staying close, but by WINNING. Wish the game was here so i could go.

In terms of Catholic schools they do give financial assistance, and there is an entrance exams that needs to be passed. As a CHS graduate and seeing the "city school" kids leave after 1 or 2 years is not because of money but because of academics.

thats my point. why even bother top recruit them if you know they grades stink. duck dont turn to a magic goose just cause you wear a school uniform

yale cup -

This is nothing unusual for Timon and I've taken some heat in the two seasons prior for some who thought I had the Tigers ranked too low for the same reasons.

I, and I'm assuming the rest of the pollsters, continue to rank Timon because I believe there are not 10 large schools in WNY better than them. Close loses to three of the top four (Canisius, at Jamestown, & St. Joe's). They did beat Kenmore West, who was ranked at the time.

Also took into account that Dante Williams was out for both the Canisius and Roch East losses this weekend. It's possible things go differently if he had played - I remember you not wanting Olean's loss to count against them because Eckstrom did not play.

The only team I have behind them is Sweet Home, who lost to Ken West and does not have any wins over top 10 teams. The Panthers' best win would either be Nichols or Will South.

I'd be interested to hear any suggestions of teams who should be in the top 10 that are not. But I cannot think of any that have better wins than Timon or that I think would beat Timon.

They still recruit kids they know have poor grades because there is the chance they will turn around a few for every so many that do not improve and return to public schools after a year or two.

It is the risk reward, with little risk for the school and a decent to high reward.

It's my understanding that if a kid leaves after two years because of money problems, and returns to his home district , he must re-take courses that he has already passed because there is no proof of his grades. Is this correct?

Recruiting has been going on in hs hoops for decades now. It's only natural for any organization in a competitive environment to go after talent to get even better. Nichols pursuing a Stan Weir, is no different than CC trying to lure Roger W away from gr55. Let's face it, talent attracts talent.

Unaware of that one BBBfan, but I think there is a rule stating you cannot transfer from one catholic school to another just to play sports.

Not basketball related, but take a look at Canisius HS running back Qadree Ollison. The junior from Niagara Falls went to Canisius because of the opportunities that Canisius offered. Not sure how he does academically, but because he chose Canisius, he has many more recourses than would he have stayed at NF. If he had stayed at NF, do you think he would have received a letter from Alabama? Probably not. And yes he did receive a letter of interest from the two time defending champs.

Who cares about how they r doing grade-wise. As long as they r helping the teams win games they r doing their job. Half these kids take off after the season ends. Who cares? Paul Harris never went 2 class but that was a fun team we all enjoyed watching in 2004 and 2005.

Like the kid with the freckles said in Fast Times at Ridgemont High about the star football player - I think his name was 'Jefferson' - 'Man I didn't know he actually went 2 school here, I thought he just flew in 4 the games'

THAT is how it should b! :):)

Bill, I'm not sure what you mean when you say "pursued" Stan Wier. Perhaps you can explain.

I've written before what the back story on that was and I believe his family did as well. But for your sake here goes again.

Stan played hoops and stayed at EA his freshman year to play ball with his older brother Thad who was a senior that year. They had a great year losing in the sectional finals as I recall.

Stan and his dad approached coaches at Nichols, Canisius and Frannies in April or May of that year. They were looking to transfer and seeking a better basketball situation as it turns out. I don't think any of the schools recruited or "pursued" him before that. Once the Wiers made their intentions known, I am quite sure the schools approached pointed out the benefits of their school as you would expect.

I think everyone is familiar with the rest of the story.

Why should private schools release transcripts if the kids never paid all the tuition? No different than college. Should the kids be allowed to bounce around, w/out consequence? If they can't keep good grades now, its not like college gets easier!!!

Perhaps schools like 'CHS' should be more selective when they admit students and not put them in a position where they cannot succeed...High School should be about learning, not sports.

High school is and should be about learning. Learning, however, comes in all shapes and sizes and forms. Sports plays a significant role in the learning process. It reinforces what it takes to be successful in academics and also shows the value of team work and functioning well within a group.

I agree with McShea is God. If Olean wins the State title this year I don't care if any of the kids go to class, or get good grades, nor should I. Why do you guys think kids are living in coaches basements? Education is not that big of a deal just go to school to have fun, make friends, play sports.

Hoopster...I agree. My kids all played three sports while in high school, and it was vital to their development. The concern is when schools admit students who have no chance of succeeding in the classroom, simply because they are a great athlete. That's why they have an entrance exam, to ensure the student will be able to handle the course load. Some schools in the area actually use the test for that reason, others disregard it which leads to kids failing. Unfortunately at some schools winning games is more important than teaching kids.

If we admit students with no chance to succeed and then they are forced to leave back to the city schools, how do they end up on the court there? Are there no eligibility standards for city teams? We aren't the bad guys for holding them accountable. Obviously the city schools subscribe to MIG's ridiculous theories!

We're on the same page my friend. Of course there is another possibility too; that the kid passes the entrance exam and demonstrates the capacity to succeed, but just doesn't do the school work, go to class, do homework, seek extra help, ask questions, study, etc. etc. etc.

Therefore, I think it would be hard for any of us to say with any certainty what happens in any particular situation. What I do know though is that any kid regardless of his circumstances can achieve great things and be successful if they work hard, persevere, keep their nose clean, learn from their mistakes/failures and, of course, not give up.

Alright, time for this bear to go back into hibernation!!

CC keep up the excellent writing and analysis. Well done!!

Seems like last year tentative brackets were up on the Section 6 website by now. Sure, they changed, but it was fun to watch the seedings take shape in the last weeks of the season.

What gives this year?

"Alright, time for this bear to go back into hibernation!" After reading that line it hit me like a slap to the back of the head.

Hoopster ,you resemble the bear from The Jungle Book. You're about the same size, You walk with the same gait, and you offer knowledge to the young in a caring and effective tone. "look for the bear neccesities, the simple bear neccessities..."

For those who like to bring up the tired old argument of the privates recruiting athletes, you need to get out front underneath that rock you live under and get some fresh air. Parent's pursue the privates to improve the chances of their kid's success in greater #'s than what you tirelessly imply. It is truly hypocritical when you refuse to acknowledge that many of the suburban public schools actively and succesfully bring kid's into their schools to improve the likelihood of success on the gridiron and the hardwood. I live in such a district that borders the city of Buffalo and have scene kid's droped off at the bus stop to be taken to their suburban school.

These schools would not have experienced some of the championships they have won without pursuing outside talent. And yes they are also in a better learning enviroment by attending these schools.

In both of the examples given above parents are sacrificing to improve the overall High School experience for the kid's. If the kid's choose to tank it in the classroom than the opportunity to compete should be taken away.

From MIG
"Who cares about how they r doing grade-wise. As long as they r helping the teams win games they r doing their job. Half these kids take off after the season ends. Who cares?"

MIG this is not Rome and those are not gladiators you go out to watch. Other people's kid's are not here for your entertainment, and the schools have a obligation to provide guidance so they can hopefully live happy, successful and productive lives.

What gives this year with the brackets is that the guys have adopted the format of the girls bball website but some coaches are lazy and fail to properly update game results. Thus, the standings are skewed.

Maybe I misspoke when I said Nichols pursued Stan Weir, so thanks for the history lesson chad. But as I recall, Stan played at EA, Nichols, some out of state school, and EA again. None of those schools turned him away, nor should they have. He is a phenomenal player and I'm sure will continue to be at UB. So in THAT case I suppose it was reverse recruiting, but recruiting of individuals by schools in section 6 (both private and public) has been going on for decades and will continue. As Michael Corleone said to Kay "Now who's being naive?" Just remember Desales in Lockport in late '80,s. And many of the great LaSalle players lived north of Hyde Park Blvd, if you know what I mean.

Clearly you cannot use stan wier as an example. the kid played at 4 highschools in 4 years. his dad is neurotic and clearly he must have had issues cause he couldnt stick at any of the schools.

Why don't you tell us "the whole story!"

I think we can leave Stan's dad out of this. So what he played at 3 schools in four hs years? Clearly he was a credit to all three schools both in the classroom and on the court. I would imagine the goal for any highly talented hs player is to achieve a full ride at a D1 school, and Stan was able to do just that. I am looking forward to watching him play the next four years, as I'm sure many Bulls fans are as well. Let's have some perspective and stop looking for scandal in every thing out there. If you look hard enough there are some GOOD stories. This is definitely one of them. Congrats to Stan and his family.

Went 2 McKinley and Nichols and NEITHER school last night had Mountain Dew 4 sale. It shows the sad state of our society in 2013.

I bet Stan Weir and his Dad like Mountain Dew.

Let me tell you something, MIG. I know Stan Weir and his father, and they most certainly do like Mountain Dew. On a more related note to this blog however, can anyone tell me why the candy the week of the sectionals is $2.09?? I mean, why not just $2.00. Or if they have to squeeze the profit, then go to $2.10. Much like our friends to the north, I don't carry pennies around with me.

The path to the D1 scholarship for Stan was unconventional, but it worked, so hat's off to the family for helping make Stan and his father's dreams come true.

Stan is by all accounts a great kid and all the movement wasn't his choice alone, nor was the fact that he was older than most high school seniors last year. Don't believe that to be true? Check out the Bulls roster and you will see he is only 7 months younger than junior Javon McCrea.

Does that mean Mcrea is a young junior or Weir is an older freshman? That's a judgement call. You will also see that their is one Bull with no DOB listed.

Truth is, it doesn't matter, he is a scholarship basketball player at Buffalo and only time will tell what type of player he will be. Either way, best of luck.

Walter touched on something important that everyone should bear in mind during these discussions:

Stan is a great kid. He's polite, respectful, and works his tail off to be a good student and basketball player. I think at the very least, that combination deserves the respect of everyone who comments here.

Stan is the one of the most polite kids i have met and always goes out of his way to say hello to people. I wish him luck @ UB. hopefully he can get through injuries and back on the court. Perhaps one of the top commenters can enlighten us on the missing DOB. it's really not that important though. there are no age restrictions or requirements.
After further review, maybe the top 10 should be reduced to a top 8. Both polls don't seem very deep this year. hope to see some sleepers at buff st this year.
Who are your top sleepers that will make an appearance at buff st. that are not currently ranked?

Williamsville South
South Park
Lake Shore
East Aurora

I could see a Buffalo charter school other than Oracle making a splash, Olmstead? also all of ECIC 3 is always a sleeper. Tonawanda or Lackawanna come around and hit CleveHill. That 3rd win is always elusive.

When Karl Haire played at Niagara after serving in the Army I'm pretty sure he was 42. No age requirements, just 4 years of eligibility.
$2.09 for a bag of skittles?? C'mon man.

I don't think TSA is going to screen the guests at the sectionals, but you never know. So Andy, I suggest you bring your own damn skittles. :) Seriously, $2.09?

I have to make two trips for all the stuff I bring with me, and I still order a pizza delivered to courtside.

I tell you one thing. I really hope you and Nate order that pizza with the bacon and all that other good stuff on it. Me and The Other Guy never ate so good.

A-1 is horrible

Niagara Frontier League this year is super weak. Like usual, Niagara Falls is the class. The rest of the teams look like middle schoolers compared to the Falls. It is amazing how some of the teams like Ken East, GI, Lew Port and Niagara Wheatfield got so bad. There has to be something done at those schools to peak the interest of athletes to play basketball at an early age as it doesn't look good for the future of the NFL. Are other winter sports grabbing the good athletes? On another note, Q. Campbell is a big disappointment for Ken West this year. He had a great supporting cast last year that allowed him to lounge around the paint and get gimme points and bounds. Without them he appears to be suffering. He looked lost against Crumpton and the Falls.

A-1 is horrible? Take a look at A-2!! Hate to say it but there are going to be some bad teams in semi-final games at Buff St.

1 good thing about Buff State they DO have Mountain Dew! I hear they r making the pizza NOW so it is ready 4 Feb 25th.

JCC will b real fun this year. D game is always good then Middle College-Oracle and Silver Creek-Maple Grove.

I also think 2 live in this country u should have 2 learn how 2 speak English.

Kansas losing 2 TCU would b like Niagara Falls losing 2 Ripley. Biggest upset in College hoops in 20 years. TCU was 0-9 in Big 12 (Yes the Big 12 has TEN teams and the Big 10 has TWELEVE-love that) and had lost all 9 games by MORE than 10 points.

Bill Self called it 'the worst team Kansas has put on the floor since Dr. Naismith was there'

Great article on the Reagan family in yesterday's paper. Larry is a great guy who raised a great family. Must b nice 2 b able 2 talk 2 your son when u want 2 :)

I would say it would be like the Falls losing to Ken East. Falls losing to Ripley would be like Kansas losing to Longwood.

I am devastated by the Kansas loss. it's going to be tough to pull myself together this weekend and coach my team against Miami. The "U" is a real power in the ACC this year. Rock Chalk, Lawrence Kansas.

According to Section V basketball's website, if the playoffs started today, Kearney would be the 8th seed, play a pre-quarterfinal game and then the quarterfinal game would be at #1 Webster Schroeder. Reminds me of the time when Grover Cleveland had Eric Rawls and Jose Narvaez a few years back and had to travel to Olean for a quarterfinal game and lost.

AA1 in section V is certainly interesting. Rush, Thomas and BK are all very close for the 6-8 seeds. BK has three games remaining, Edison today who they will beat, then two games against NJ teams, Elizabeth and Roselle Catholic. Both are 14-4 and in the top 20 of the NJ state ranks. Assuming a split in those games, it is still likely BK will get the 6 seed due to Rush's final two games being against Fairport and Penfield(they could lose both) and Thomas facing Penfield and Schroeder(could also easily lose both).

Wow. I think Bishop Kearney's schedule was harder than Syracuse University's traditional November and December Domefest. Maybe Kearney's plan was brilliant after all. Or maybe statechamps analogy is correct, and they go down in the quarters. Either way, I think Section V will dominate the large school regionals this year.

Dominate as in win the two games or dominate as in dominate?

I think both the AA and A games at the regionals will be exciting and competitive contests. I'll be surprised if either of those Section VI reps get handled easily.

I mean dominate in every facet of the tournament. Better programs, better venue, better food at the venue, better restaurant within walking distance of the arena(dinosaur-get the pulled pork). I think Rochester wins the AA game by 10-12 points, and although closer, will win the A game as well. You guys might win B with Olean, but I'm John Wallace and I don't care about the B game. Plus, our section has John Moriello, who is about to be inducted in the Hall of Fame Glenns Falls wknd. However James Johnson and Keith McShea is probably a push, with the slight edge to McShea. (I watch that prep talk TV- enough said)

Johnny boy...in A, the Macks will be an extremely tough out for Charlotte/Newark/AQ...they are more tested than all of those teams and very deep.

Besides Olean, MEC/Silver Creek/Oracle would all be favorites in the C game.

Wil South destroys Sweet Home in rematch. Imagine their will be a shakeup in the polls next week. I would not give the A title to Mckinley just yet, Too Much Love.

The Macks will run over either South or SH.

Mckinley is good this year, but I don't think they have the talent of some Macks teams a few years back.

surprised timon hasnt beaten a good team yet

Guest. I can' t remember the last time they have. Drop them out of top 10 until they do. I don't care who replaces them. What makes it worse is it people think its a quality win for the other MMA teams that beat them. Overrated.

I have been watchiing closely the AA bracket and those teams and I have to say that the Clarence team looks like they could do some damage. They seem to have flown under the radar this entire season. I watched them play last night and they did not play their best but they have been taking care of the teams that are in their league quite easily. The games they have lost have been only against other top ten schools and they have given Oracle and Amherst their only loses of the season. Plus a big quality win over Will North. With that said, when the top ten comes out the pollsters for some reason put the Devils below Amherst which I do not understand because they beat them and Amherst has not beaton one top ten school all year, they also play in ECIC 3 which is not all that strong. So where is that logic.

I also like Ken West over Amherst and Sweet Home when it comes to the top ten. Campbell from Ken West would have an easy time against either of those teams and Wests guards would be to physical for either of them. Pollsters need to do a better job of checking who these teams have quality wins over. The referees who are on the poll need to be sure they take their time and vote for the appropriate teams and who they have beaten.

Falls seems to be vulnerable and North, Jamestown and Clarence can all beat one another any day. My sleeper in the AA would be Lockport. They can give teams troubles with all their athleticism, they would have no problem with Amherst either.

To me the AA has the most talent this year and should make for a fun playoff run.

Tommy Campion deserves to be first team all WNY Saw him play 11 times this season and went to at least 50 other games and he has shown me to be very deserving

The "city" kids that fail to keep up at Catholic High Schools is normally because they fail classes not because of tuition. Most are given a free ride. You can lead a horse to water but you can't make him drink! It's quite sad that given opportunities with every tool to succeed is available yet most of them don't put in any effort! There has to be at least some responsibility at home however; this is usually where they are stripped of their chance to succeed.
How is it that when a student-athlete returns to public school and continues to fail the student portion they remain on the court? That is not beneficial to anyone... Probably one of the reasons the drop out rate is so high in Buffalo. What is the lesson for that student or the others that are actually trying to pass their classes? Student-athletes should be just that... A student first! Grades do matter unless high school is your final stop towards education. What's worse is that grown men are riding the backs of these failing students based on their athletic ability to boost their "coaching/recruiting credibility" and not putting any focus on the kids education present or future. They are selling them "hoop dreams" that will never come to fruition since you must have academic standings to even be eligible for NCAA. Maybe I'm wrong... I think ECC has a basketball team but they do have an entrance exam also... Hmmm, that means a community college won't even accept you unless your academic standings are in order.

It looks like the two games that BK was supposed to play this weekend in NJ have been cancelled.

How about MEC v BK and/or Nichols v BK...would be a great test for both local teams before playoffs start. I doubt any section V teams have open dates...at least any competitive team, especially with the postponements that were made there on Friday.

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